ECONOMY CRASHING. BTC TO A MILLION

alex_eph612: So, what is the preliminary topic of discussion?

Kulture0x: I feel everybody just talk about anything and everything, but whatever the conversation leads into.

alex_eph612: All righty, let's get some.

Kulture0x: I'm sure it'll. I'm sure it'll lead into a lot of stuff that's been going on lately, you know what I mean?

alex_eph612: Yes.

Kulture0x: But so the trick is for the rice is you want to use forbidden rice or brown rice. Does that has what is it called? Starts with a P. Anyways, it's good for detoxing your body for environmental stress. White rice, jasmine rice doesn't do that. I feel like it's relevant. So, okay, I'm done eating now.

alex_eph612: Let me actually.

Kulture0x: My only chance. That was my only chance to eat today. Been like in between meetings all day. One thing I wanted to like talk about is you know there's a lot of people on X that are like constantly during a bear market or on social media in general, like rating and shit, and to me it just like I'm just like you know get a job because you're gonna because I think you're gonna like impact your token or crypto more by instead of trying to extract you know actually Deposit funds into the ecosystem because this is the time you want to be loading up on whatever coin you can. Hold on, I have another request. That's you. Okay, request to speak. There you go. So that's one thing I want to talk about? This is the best time to actually get a job, instead of being a you know or whatever slave wage. Got to do what you got to do. Get two or three if you have to. Then you can't blame people for not spending as much time on X because they're busy trying to you know make scratch so they can buy more tokens. I don't blame them. So a lot of people forget about that part of it. The other thing I want to talk about is how fucked up our the world economy is right now with the interest rates rising. That's how like what 7% right now.

alex_eph612: I haven't checked, but there's just like so many levers that they can pull. It's really hard to predict which direction anything is going to go.

Kulture0x: Well, no one. Oh, the interest rate's not high, is because they have to entice people to buy the U.S. debt. No one wants to buy the debt. So,

alex_eph612: yeah, I mean, I get that, but then you, your expectation is that you know, safe assets like safe asset classes like gold and silver would go up in price, but actually, they're the automated trading algorithms are buying debt with the money that was being used to buy gold. So you have gold going down when, in fact, the economy is indicating that there is less. It's a weird,

Kulture0x: weird position.

alex_eph612: Yeah, that there is less confidence.

Kulture0x: Yeah, you have all these indicators that show that are lining up of this is actually this is what hits right before a recession or right before depression. Many people arguing, well, we're in a depression statistically already, but you have because the indicator of job you know of job Unemployment, right, is not technically where it should be to indicate that, but people have to like you know raise the interest or raise the interest they're paying on bonds, so to make it enticing. So that's probably why those automated trading systems are buying up bonds, buying up debt, right?

alex_eph612: Yeah, I mean, I think they'll continue to buy them up until everything just fucking crashes.

Kulture0x: Yeah. Meanwhile, the central banks are loading up on gold, silver, probably Bitcoin too. I would imagine.

alex_eph612: Well, you know, actually, that's kind of a funny thing. You know, with all these hacks and whatnot that are occurring during the bear market, I'm seeing posts on X. Like there's like no, and this is me paraphrasing. They say stuff like you know there's no safe way to store your crypto. I tried to store it on chain. I tried to store it off chain. Everything is getting fucking hacked. My NFTs are getting deleted, and like transferred and sold and all this crap. And he's like, the only way that I feel comfortable now, you know, keeping my wealth is withdrawing everything from crypto and putting it into gold and silver in my vault, and calling it a day.

Kulture0x: Right. That's the problem. That's the problem because there needs to be more regulation in the space. It's like they don't give a shit.

alex_eph612: Well, I don't know. I feel like no matter how hard it's regulated, there's still going to be like exploitable contracts and single points of failure. I mean,

Kulture0x: like for instance, like in cybersecurity, you have you have compliance, regulation, compliance, right? So you have a cybersecurity framework. There's no crypto cybersecurity framework, and there's no regulated body that enforces it. So all you have to do is say if you want to be a company that has anything to do with crypto, you have to be certified, or you have to have audited. You'd have to comply to the cybersecurity framework. At least that's a step in the right direction. And then the other thing is actually put a task force in there that's Paid well, and given all the tools available, is like you know the CIA or FBI, maybe even more so. They're trading crypto and tracking down criminals, and start making, start enforcing it. Just start cracking down, putting people in prison for a long time. Just this, you want to dissuade bad behavior, right?

alex_eph612: Yeah, of course. Well, you know, I used to think that crypto is kind of like a nascent industry, and you know, it needs to evolve and it needs to get regulation and all this sort of stuff. But I felt like that the reason that there was so much fraud and scamming in this industry is because it had not matured. But really, now I hold the opinion that crypto is more of like a microcosm of the world, and no one else is serious either. And you know, crypto is just a very raw reflection of the world as it is right now.

Kulture0x: That's actually you know interesting because you think about it, it's almost like the idiocracy of the world, right? Like gambling and apps and everything you see now. And there used to be like a lot of regulation in gambling, and that's it's like you know it's in coin. It's in centralized exchanges like Coinbase, and it's like the whole world X Y Z Solana thing. Like we're gonna save the trenches blood by having them lose their money on gambling. It's ridiculous, but it's like everywhere you go, it's gambling ads, and your influencers, people you look into, are telling you to do the prize picks and the fan tools, and it's so you can't get away from it. So it's you know less regulation there too. So if you're not going to regulate that, what makes you think they're going to regulate crypto?

alex_eph612: Yeah, exactly.

Kulture0x: But

alex_eph612: well,

Kulture0x: I do think that people will store BT Bitcoin and Ethereum because it's a lot easier to get your hands on than it is gold and store. Easier to store your capital than that than gold.

alex_eph612: Yeah. Well, I have a friend. He's kind of taking a break from crypto right now, and he says, like, if you want to figure out what the real money is, figure out what you can get. Like, what, figure out the what's easier to get versus what's harder to get. And I'll tell you this: it's a lot easier to get crypto using gold than it is to get gold using crypto.

Kulture0x: That makes sense.

alex_eph612: And how would you

Kulture0x: transfer gold to crypto?

alex_eph612: Well, one particular way is you could sell it to appmax.com, so apmax.com, and they'll actually I think I don't think they will do that. They accept crypto as a payment processor to buy gold using BitPay, but they don't do it the other way around. If you want to do it the other way around, you essentially have to take your gold to a coin shop or like a high volume dealer, have them write you a cashier chuck, which you deposit to your bank, and then I guess buy your crypto with Kraken or whatever other exchange. Yeah, but the point that he was trying to make is that the true. Hard valuable money is what no one wants to give away, so you have you know central banks and governments buying up huge swaths of gold and keeping it for themselves and not letting anyone else have it. Yeah, and the only the only money that rather the only exposure that retail is able to get to gold and silver is via custodial assets like ETFs and tokenized assets like XAUT and PAXAG

Kulture0x: are those the ones that back their currency gold the crypto

alex_eph612: yeah well you know we don't know what they back it with. All we know is that

Kulture0x: allegedly,

alex_eph612: yeah, yeah, allegedly. Just that we know that it's pegged until it's not,

Kulture0x: right? Well, that's because people. I don't. I think countries are moving away from using the U.S. dollars or reserve currency.

alex_eph612: Yeah. Well, you know, I hope that it happens in my lifetime. That would be interesting to see.

Kulture0x: Would be right. Well, I know that if that were to ever happen, Bitcoin would go through the roof.

alex_eph612: Ah, likely. That's probably what'll happen. I mean, if Bitcoin is denominated in hyperinflating currency, obviously it's going to go up.

Kulture0x: I think our yeah our currencies are already pretty much well we're in a hyperinflation right now. I don't think they're trying to slow it down.

alex_eph612: Yeah,

Kulture0x: that's why they keep rising the interest rates. No, it's not working.

alex_eph612: Yeah, hopefully it happens soon. I'm tired of waiting to be honest,

Kulture0x: stagflation.

alex_eph612: Yeah,

Kulture0x: what it feels like to me. And when have you ever seen an economy stall this long? Like even in the 2005 housing crisis with subprime mortgages, it didn't. It didn't take this long for you know whatever to happen to happen. It just happened. We knew about it, and then we were starting to rebuild. Right. It took like five years.

alex_eph612: Yeah.

Kulture0x: But we've been dealing with this like what since 2022.

alex_eph612: You know, I don't know I I've just been kind of like living my life and trying to focus on you know my own world I don't have a lot of like insight into like global economy. My only like the two philosophical tenets I have with regards to owning assets is that I have custody of them, and I try. That's really the only thing that I try to do. So that's why I'm invested heavily in physical precious metals as well as crypto, because no one else can like take it from me. Like if they want to take it, they have to come to my house.

Kulture0x: So let's see who we got in the room here. We got Godnode, Frogboy, just not yet. A few Ramelas. Are those Romelos?

alex_eph612: What's that?

Kulture0x: Berry Pink Grill and Berry Evil Grill.

alex_eph612: That's Carew.

Kulture0x: Oh, Ramila, they are Ramillas. That's cool. I like the PFPs. So, are we gonna? I guess we can wait if we want to talk about anything else. But I don't know. I try to make it. I try to make the space at a time where it was earlier enough for me to get on. It wasn't too late, but I'm wondering if it was just a little early.

alex_eph612: Well, Tim said he'll join at four, but honestly, like I'm gonna be honest, I don't really see a lot of interest or traction with this particular.

Kulture0x: Yeah, it looks like there's some people the CTMMZ. one's also going right now.

alex_eph612: Yeah,

Kulture0x: you know what that

alex_eph612: one is? No.

Kulture0x: Shocker room, CTMZ after party.

alex_eph612: Oh, is that right?

Kulture0x: I wonder if we should join it. Is CTMMZ? Is that? That's that article that was just posted. That

alex_eph612: can you post a link to that? Yeah, on Capital Flow.

Fren 1: Shit, I'm not in it right now. I don't have to tell them. Let me get my phone and do it.

Kulture0x: I don't know what they're talking about, but it says it could be talking about you know what.

alex_eph612: I'll just stand by for. All

Fren 1: right. I'll put it in capital flow.

alex_eph612: Okay. Let me take a look.

Kulture0x: We'll call this one the spaces. We didn't really gain any traction. I was hoping to talk about the whole. You know.

alex_eph612: I'm still. I still don't have the link.

Fren 1: Okay, one sec.

Kulture0x: Okay, you get it.

alex_eph612: Yeah, I see it now. Let me see what's going on over there.

Fren 2: All right.

Kulture0x: You guys want me to blast the music?

Fren 1: Alexis, please don't.

Kulture0x: I just got a new movie life album in, and 156 silence. That's what I was playing when I first started my spaces.

alex_eph612: So,

Kulture0x: I did want to ask you about the wrapping the NFTs because I thought that was kind of cool. Did that get shut down by people or what? Oh,

alex_eph612: there was a lot of interest in it. You know, obviously, no one wants to pay the trading fee. However, I am not an expert in NFT contracts, so there's a possibility that the endpoint can be blacklisted by the original deployer. So this is something that I need to research with the developer that I trust, and basically have them do an audit of the existing contract and see if there is any levers that the original deployer can pull in order to prevent it from working as expected.

Kulture0x: Yeah, I think that's a really good idea. I mean, because at the end of the day. I think that having it in house and not all the funds going to 5g, who's no longer obviously no longer involved with the project, I think that would be ideal. And if we can do it with relatively, you know, No, like if we can do it seamlessly,

alex_eph612: yeah.

Kulture0x: That I don't think that it would. I don't. I don't see what the what the problem is. I mean, with the URL, the landing page, and stuff change on OpenSea, obviously, right? How do we coordinate it with that with them?

alex_eph612: So the wrapped contract would essentially be a collection that's backed by the previous one, so it would it would be two separate collections for a little while until like most of the traders migrate over to the new one.

Fren 1: Got it.

alex_eph612: But they'll basically you know be exactly the same, and the difference between this and a relaunch is that with a relaunch you have to convince 100% of the participants of the previous launch to migrate over, but with a wrapped contract you don't have to convince anyone. That you can basically just say, okay, here's this. If you want to trade NFTs between each other for free? You know, use this wrapped contract. Yeah, and if not, then just trade for the whatever 7.7% fee, the old one.

Kulture0x: So we don't even have to. We can create a zero fee so that we're not collecting any fees. It's just like not owned by G anymore.

alex_eph612: Right. So the wrapped contract is essentially like anyone can do it. Like literally, anyone can go online and create it right now. It doesn't have to be like a top-down structure. And there's a lot of popular connect collections that have done wrapped contracts before, and the reason is because their NFTs that they had launched had existed before OpenSea, right? So OpenSea became hugely popular, but there was contract code in their existing previous launches that wasn't supported. Yeah,

Kulture0x: kitties.

alex_eph612: Yeah, exactly. So they did. They're like, well, we can't relaunch because obviously these things are worth, you know, north of hundreds of 1000s of dollars or however much they're worth. You know, we can't destroy that value. So let's just wrap them. And wrapping is like, you know, it's kind of like a simple thing because, you know, everyone does it, and it's kind of like evolved to be acceptable.

Fren 1: Right.

alex_eph612: So, you know, it wouldn't be out of this world for the Apu collection to do that either.

Kulture0x: Yeah, and then we could it would give people an option. You know, they can do whatever. So we're not actually saying, "Hey, but if the volume were to switch over to the to the non fee, then even better.

alex_eph612: Yeah, and you know, truthfully, in terms of like narrative, I feel like having it a immutable contract that's audited with a 0% trading fee would be a lot more palatable to the broader community.

Kulture0x: 100%

alex_eph612: Yeah, like if we if we start saying we're going to have a Dow or something like that, oh, it's not going to be 7% but instead it's going to be like 3% You know, people are just going to be like trying to figure out who they like the most,

Fren 1: right?

alex_eph612: Or right, and that's not that's something I want to avoid. I just want to, you know, be true to crypto, crypto's roots, where there's no single point of failure.

Kulture0x: Truly decentralized.

alex_eph612: Yeah, but you know, once again, I don't even know if this is viable. And furthermore, well, I want to say it might not be viable because the contract has like restrictions in place that prevent this sort of thing. So that's something that needs to be audited, as I said before. But here's a very interesting thing that I found out yesterday. So this is called the contract under which the Apu collection launched is called ERC 720 1c, and this one has a lot of like levers that the deployer can pull in order to restrict trading if the royalty fee is not paid. And what's yeah, so they have like six different ways and six different stages, starting from like very permissive to completely locked down. I read the white paper about this yesterday, and you know what is actually kind of hilarious? The people that wrote that protocol is the same payment processor that got hacked.

Kulture0x: Oh, really? Critical or no? Was it

alex_eph612: limit break?

Kulture0x: Limit break. Yeah.

alex_eph612: Oh, yeah. They're

Kulture0x: the ones.

alex_eph612: They're the ones that wrote this, like

Kulture0x: 720 1c.

alex_eph612: Yeah, ERC 720 1c. So they wrote this, and it's kind of funny because you know this contract is code is written in a way that lets a deployer essentially have the final say for the collection, and it kind of goes against crypto's roots, and it just so happens that you know that kind of culture was baked into their organization to such a degree that you know it leaked into their other products, which caused you know exploits to be found and Manipulated.

Kulture0x: I wonder if they did it. I wouldn't be surprised if they exploited themselves.

alex_eph612: Well, you know, that's up for debate. Like you, you never know. Whenever there's a hack, it's always there's always a chance that they hack themselves.

Kulture0x: Right, but like it used to be a meme.

alex_eph612: Yeah, I think the possibility of that is quite low because everyone started using the exploit all at the same time, and there's like so many different hackers. So yeah, so someone leaked it via security channels, and then everyone started using it all at once.

Kulture0x: Yeah,

alex_eph612: but yeah, all it all it says is like it goes to show you that you really should not try to gatekeep in crypto. You really should you know write immutable contracts that are secure and don't really allow anyone to, to have like a top-down unilateral single point of failure type situation.

Kulture0x: Yeah, I mean it was designed the way it is for a reason, and that reason is to keep to keep it immutable,

alex_eph612: right,

Kulture0x: and decentralized.

alex_eph612: Yeah, but yeah, this is just the direction crypto is going.

Kulture0x: Well, yeah, we'll have to check into that because if we can, I think that I think the wrap NFTs would be extremely popular.

alex_eph612: I agree. Yeah, I agree with that, and you know, I will do my due diligence and try to figure out what is doable. However, I do have to say that there is a sentiment in Apu that we're simply focusing too much on to begin with, and we really should kind of cool it with that and focus more on the token.

Kulture0x: Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, I think we set our piece. I think whatever is out there is out there. I think people know about it. You know, there's no reason to dwell on it. There's no reason to you know keep rehashing it and keep talking about it. You know, we can explore options on how to bypass the trading fees, and if there are some, then we can. You know, I think we should all try to do that. And if not, yeah, you know, it is what it is, and we can move on from it. You know,

alex_eph612: right? It

Kulture0x: would be nice to have, because you know that it does bring up an interesting debate, though you know, or an interesting argument is, you know, do we want to have an NFT collection to represent the community where everyone's using it their VFPs and whatnot-that's, you know, not even decentralized, and people can, you know, do it. Here's the here's the thing. For instance, here's something that annoyed the hell out of me, and I don't know. Maybe it's just me. Maybe I'm just a weirdo, right, or a goon. But I thought it was I thought it was extremely annoying and frustrating where people were given custom NFTs within the collection after it already launched.

alex_eph612: So do you mean that they were given? Okay, I see what you mean. So are you saying that there were specific NFTs made for particular members of the community, and then those NFTs were gifted out.

Kulture0x: Yes,

alex_eph612: to those people.

Kulture0x: Custom traits. Yeah, like one for one. Yeah,

alex_eph612: that makes sense. Yeah, I mean, personally, it doesn't bother me all that much like I don't have an emotional reaction to that. But in terms of like a pragmatic approach, I don't think that like those one ones they're only valuable to the person that they're given to. They have like a sentimental value, and because they have that sentimental value attached only to one person, you know. There's not really all that much trading interest in that particular NFT.

Kulture0x: Yeah, I can see that. But the you know the purist in me thinks you know well it kind of takes from the traits the whole the whole point of the random generation of traits, yeah, for when you mint it. Because if someone can just go in there and edit it afterwards, the what do you call it? The you know, the data because it's stored in a in storage somewhere for all the traits. Let me just go in there and edit it after the fact.

alex_eph612: So, so I'm not privy to how this was created, but I think that they had a specific amount of one ones that were reserved,

Fren 1: right?

alex_eph612: And they got auto minted to a particular wallet and then given out. I don't think that you could

Fren 2: edit

alex_eph612: the traits once it launched. But yeah, this is a common practice. This is just like, you know, people that launch NFTs. They want that, you know, sentimental NFT made specifically for them, and you know that's perfectly fine and fair in my book. Like, if they don't get that, maybe they don't launch the collection at all.

Fren 2: Yeah, yeah.

alex_eph612: I just think it's I think it's stupid in terms of like the fact that it reduces the amount of interest in that particular NFT, and you know that drives the volume lower. I think it would be better if there was no like cults of personality

Kulture0x: rights section at all. Just it just to me, it's just weird. Yeah, to have that in a collection, but that's supposed to be like I, I like I want the whole thing to just every single one of them to be random, random traits, and you get what you get. If you don't get it, you don't get it. If you don't get it, maybe you can buy it afterwards.

alex_eph612: Right. It

Kulture0x: just adds the purity of the collection in my book. That's just me, and I figured you know if I have that if I have that viewpoint and that sentiment, then there's others out there that probably do too.

alex_eph612: Yeah.

Kulture0x: But

alex_eph612: no, that that's a fair assessment,

Kulture0x: and I you know I don't think that there's really anything as far as far as the price of the token and the NFTs and all that all that stuff. You know, I don't really think that we're going to gain much traction until the until meme coins take off again, until Bitcoin and Ethereum are done running, which could be a while.

alex_eph612: Yeah, that's very true, and we don't know what to expect with q4.

Kulture0x: Yeah, this could just be the current pump, Ethereum and Bitcoin pump could just be a speculative pre pump.

alex_eph612: Yeah,

Kulture0x: as people are waiting for q4. Regardless, though, I think you know end of end of 2020 near the end of 2027, I think the whole thing is going to take off. That's just my.

alex_eph612: Well, that would be in line with the four-year cycle.

Kulture0x: Exactly. There's going to be people that still believe in the four-year cycle. That are that in just that sentiment alone.

alex_eph612: Yeah.

Kulture0x: But yeah, so doesn't look like anyone else really wants to talk? We don't really have a whole ton of people on here right now, so I'm just going to end it early. Maybe we'll shoot for a little time. But it was cool talking to Alex about the. I like the ideas that you shared about the NFT wrapping, and I think the people who are that did come on got to hear it too, and yeah, they have some more insight to it. Yeah, you

Fren 2: just sorry.

alex_eph612: You reminded me of something. So, I was like looking at the white hat's previous tweets, and literally like a day right before he all this shit got hacked on chain, he made a funny tweet about like, oh, you know, Bitget, whatever they both got hacked. So I guess on chain is back, baby. And then like a day later, 6 million NFTs got hacked, or $6 million worth of NFTs got hacked.

Kulture0x: Why would he make that tweet?

alex_eph612: Well, he, you know,

Kulture0x: ironic. No,

alex_eph612: no, like he made the tweet before the NFTs got hacked. So he was a big proponent of on chain, right? Right. It just it's funny that he ended up saying that, and then there was a big on chain hack.

Kulture0x: Oh yeah, the irony of it.

alex_eph612: Yeah, the irony.

Kulture0x: On chain is back, and then, you know, I wouldn't be surprised that the conspiracy theorist to me wouldn't be surprised if a lot of these exchanges, like Binance, were behind a lot of these exploits to drive.

alex_eph612: It's certainly possible,

Kulture0x: yeah, to drive traffic and adoption back towards centralize. Yeah, just but you know, and the other thing is this: like, here's another thing I was thinking of: how easy would it be to integrate a revoke all button where it's like baked into the UI, it's pretty easy, you know, pretty accessible. And then there's like a little reminder. It says, you know, daily reminder to revoke all your all these contracts. Yeah, weekly. Yeah, we notice you have over 100 signed contracts. You want to revoke them, or yeah, maybe an alert saying, "Hey, this one is this contract has an alert, you know, or even

alex_eph612: just auto revoke contracts that have new versions, you know. You can

Kulture0x: even set that. I mean, how hard none of these wallets do that. That's what I'm talking about. With the, that's what I was talking, referring to when it comes to crypto regulation, like a CSF cybersecurity framework that would be mandated, is like if you want to build a wallet, a decentralized wallet. Okay, well then you have to make sure that these security practices are in place. Is there revoke feature? You know, right? You know how easy is it to access these things? A CSF would be easy to make for crypto. In fact, you know, I think that if someone took, if there were some security experts out there, especially like in crypto, because that's security and cybersecurity in general. Everyone has a niche. There's banking, finance. There's healthcare. There's you know finance. There's just there's tech, IT. There's software development. There's IT, and then there's crypto too. Is its own world of security. And if there were some crypto security experts out there, right, which there are obviously, then you know they can create a cybersecurity framework. Together, you know, and then they could present it as, "Hey, this is this can be used and mandated, you know, and adopted, even if it wasn't federally enforced.

alex_eph612: Yeah, I mean that certainly would help, but we also have to remember that crypto started as like a solution to the so-called debit card problem. So you know, with when you have a debit card, you essentially, when you make a transaction with it, you're essentially, to put it in crypto terms, you're creating a contract that allows someone to debit from that number. And what Satoshi had done, that was like, you know, his own invention was to separate the payments sent out from the payments being sent in. So the public key and the private key had been separated for so long, right? And in 2015, when the Bitcoin core devs essentially kind of blackballed Metallic and Ethereum. He went ahead and created Ethereum and baked in smart contract code into that protocol. But like, you can't sign contracts unless you kind of uninvent Satoshi's invention, right? And then you have the public key and the private key no longer separate, and you have like the same wallet that you're using to receive money, being you know creating contracts to send it, and that's essentially an invention of the actual you know crypto invention of Bitcoin itself.

Kulture0x: Yeah, exactly. I mean, it opens doors, but it also detracts from the overall goal of what Bitcoin was intended to be.

alex_eph612: Right, but you know, it's kind of funny for like the first six years of Bitcoin, and I guess for the first six years of crypto, you were the only one who signed transactions, right? And then, you know, once Ethereum launched and all these fancy wallets came out, now you're giving permission to third parties to sign on your behalf, and all this does is it turns crypto into just a shittier version of the previous financial system.

Kulture0x: Yeah, I can see that, but I can also see that it does. But there's no centralized. Well, yeah, there's no. I mean, yes and no. I mean, it's not as. I guess you could say it's more decentralized, and it's not as centralized as like you know the banking system.

alex_eph612: Yeah, I mean it definitely is better in some aspects, but it seems like we're kind of devolving into the existing system. Now you have these huge exchanges and these you know tokenized, you know third party, you know issuers that essentially say, "Oh, we promise that we hold, you know, a certain amount of assets to back this particular token. You know, it just it causes the possibility of a large amount of fraud into the system.

Kulture0x: Right, and then with the token launches, and the front-loading contracts, and all the other. Now, I remember listening to an interview that what's his name, something Zilla, Coffeezilla, had with one of the people that launched the Trump token and the Melania token, and he was saying there's no way to stop snipers from front-loading contracts. Yeah, well, there are there are ways you could do it.

alex_eph612: Yeah,

Fren 2: you could block. Of course,

alex_eph612: there are. But you know, even like the simple methods of like at least playing this cat and mouse game with snipers. You know, none of that has to actually Happen right? There, there is a simple way, but no one wants to do it, and that is essentially using off-the-shelf crypto proof-of-work mining algorithms in order to prevent snakes.

Kulture0x: Oh, like the classic rate. Like I'm not sure if you were ever aware of it, there was a protocol called Raven.

alex_eph612: Yeah, I've heard of it.

Kulture0x: And there, Raven was kind of an kind of a fork of Bitcoin, but with some different, a few different mechanisms in it. But yeah,

alex_eph612: you proof of work essentially allows for the slow release of tokens, and it makes for a fair launch.

Kulture0x: Right. Another. But I mean, if you were to do it, another I launched a token, had a project once, and it was called Gray Token, and it was pretty successful. And then they eventually this I got ousted, got of it, and they was. As soon as the tokens the liquidity unlocked, it was like I think it was like over a million dollars, $1.5 million worth of liquidity.

Fren 2: It was a

Kulture0x: multi sig wallet, but as soon as it expired, they moved it. The other guy,

alex_eph612: right.

Kulture0x: So that's

alex_eph612: pretty typical.

Kulture0x: Yeah, and then they took the then they renamed the crypto the token, and then they kicked me from the project. They called it what they call it conducts and yes. But anyways, when I did my launch, it was essentially you could only buy like $1,000 worth of tokens. That was the max allocation you do. And anything else that tried to buy within the first, I think you know, few hours of trading, or I can't remember how many hours it was, like large snipes was blacklisted, and the wallets were put it were burned, the tokens were burned.

alex_eph612: Right. I mean that's better than nothing. But you know these days, people just defer to the automatic market makers, like Uniswap and Radium and whatnot, in order to essentially try to make a fair launch. But the problem is that someone with a large amount of money that's you know at the right place at the right time is going to be there to snipe it, and no no amount of like playing cat and mouse with these snipers is ever going to solve the actual problem because you're essentially playing you know red versus blue against them, and if you improve, they improve, and if they improve, then you have to improve. So it's never solvable. Truly, it's just like you just keep iterating, and then someone is better at it than you are.

Kulture0x: Right, and with that with that methodology, but I mean with the one I created, if you set the you set the rules ahead of the you set the rules ahead of the game, and you say you let everyone know these are the rules, and here's what's going to happen if you don't play by the rules, right? You're going to lose your you're going to lose your whatever you buy during that time with it within with outside of these rules, you're going to lose,

alex_eph612: yeah, and then

Kulture0x: burn it. So it's like you think you gave them for fair warning. They just wanted to you know test it out. They wanted to fuck around, and they found out. That makes sense. I mean, literally, it worked, and it was a fair launch. And but no one wants to do. No one really wants to do a fair launch. They want to say they just want to make excuses because people are stupid. Yes, people are. So to the new people, the retail in a bull market. You know, FOMO and fear and greed are the ultimate emotions that control people's decisions. So, in a bull market, it's greed. In a bear market, it's fear. Right. So,

alex_eph612: yeah.

Kulture0x: In a bull market, people just want to ape shit. They don't really care because they're like, "Well, I'll make it up in the volume,

alex_eph612: right?

Kulture0x: And there'll be enough trading activity where it won't matter.

alex_eph612: Yeah, and you know, ultimately, you have to realize, and I think you're kind of getting to this point that retail really doesn't care about fair launches, so there's no reason to provide it for them. Sad as it is to say,

Kulture0x: they really don't. Yeah, they just want to. They just want to get in and out. I mean, I guess you have a portion of them that do care because they're the ones left pulling the bag,

alex_eph612: right?

Kulture0x: And then you have the ones who are just trying to get in and out. Like I don't care. It's gambling to me. They see it as gambling.

alex_eph612: Sure. Yeah, and there's how would you say there really is no benefit to being an idealist in crypto anymore. That's very blackpilling because you know there's a plenty of people holding that projects that are really really good you know from a technical perspective, and they don't make any money ever.

Kulture0x: Yeah, and I guess it's just coming to realization. You have to come to the realization that's where we are, because when I first started in crypto, that was what people cared about was the viability of the project, the utility of it, the tech, the you know the tech

alex_eph612: right

Kulture0x: really really was about the tech at one point when people did invest and hold long into projects but we got the bastardization of it and everyone came in and created a turned it into gambling and the whole Frenchy mindset and so it became this constant rotation, rotation culture, and that's kind of where we're at. Is it literally is just a giant casino black belt moment, right?

alex_eph612: Right. Well, you know, we are in the bear market, and there's really just like a you know a funny quote. Someone on Twitter basically said, "There's only like 1000 of us." Here and we're all just like pumping the same shit and rotating, so you know pretty much. Yeah, yeah. I do have high expectations for the bull once it returns, but as of now, it's pretty fucking hard.

Kulture0x: Yeah, that's what you know. A lot of people don't get about this whole like you know people get frustrated in a bear market because the coin's not pumping. There's people still you know just giving up. They're giving into their emotions and or they need the money. Some people just need the money. Who knows what they're going through at the time? But and then you get other people who are you know have that cult like behavior mindset, you know, we're doing all this, we're raiding, we're doing all this, but you know, you're spinning your wheels. That's all you're doing. There really is. There's only like 1000 of us here. It's true, and the rest of it, they're like bots,

alex_eph612: right?

Kulture0x: Dead internet theory,

alex_eph612: right? Exactly. Well, you know, I don't want to be completely blackpiling. I don't know how much of this I can talk about, but I'm going to try to hint at it. So this is APU specific. So I'm getting rumors from the old like rugby or whales that they're starting to get interested in Ethereum memes again, and they're really kind of disheartened with regards to what has happened, what has transpired with up with Apu and with 5g and all this sort of thing. So they they're like you know debating whether or not they want to participate in Apu again, or perhaps even try to relaunch it or something like that, and I conveyed to them that I don't believe in relaunches. I think that the market is the market punishes relaunches very severely, and all it does is it essentially splits the community between the two contracts, and just essentially is a slow race to the bottom. So I convey to them that a relaunch is not a good idea, and you know they're all really upset with the previous team and how they handled everything. So, at some point, there will there will be a moment where they're interested in buying, and that moment isn't here yet, but I think it will come soon. So, at some point, there will be a catalyst that reinvigorates their interest.

Kulture0x: Right, and who knows what that'll be?

alex_eph612: Right,

Kulture0x: you know, like old, you know, the best advice I ever got, and it's pretty cheesy. It still holds true though, is time heals all wounds. After every breakup, you feel like the world's gonna end, and that girl or guy or whatever it is, you know, you're into, you know, was the was the only one for you, right? And right, you remember all the bad things going on, every mistake you made, and everything that went wrong, and the world's ending. But you know, over time, you totally completely forget about them, and life's great again. And that holds true with anything. Look, Papu, this too shall pass. Another one of those, right? Like, give it time. People will forget all about it. It'll be it'll just be another meme.

alex_eph612: Yeah.

saucestaja: Yep. I agree with that.

Kulture0x: Sentiment has a way of just, you know, cycling. Just like our, you know, in true crypto fashion. You know, that's we're in a bear market. Sentiments down, things slowly start picking back up. Gain some steam. Yeah,

saucestaja: because the only people who know about the micro events on the chart are us. If you're new and you're looking at the chart, and the chart has life, that's all the thing that matters.

Kulture0x: Exactly. And then the other thing is too is like this also happened in like the depths of the winter of the bear market, it's a good thing this isn't happening in you know bull market.

alex_eph612: Yeah, and you know, from an ontological perspective, it really is the only time that it could possibly happen is right now because

Fren 1: true.

alex_eph612: If everyone has money, then everyone is you know fat and happy and doesn't really care, but once we start rugging, you know, people are left scrambling over what they believe is fair and due to them.

Kulture0x: And Alex, you've been in crypto for quite a long time, probably almost as long as I have.

Fren 2: Yeah, and so you've

Kulture0x: probably seen it all before, and I have two, and this is nothing new. It's like whatever project you're in before Apu, whether it was a utility coin or it was a meme coin, there was always drama in a bear market. There are always rugs in a bear market, and sentiment was at its complete worst. And that's when you. Tell me, like these Ethereum wells are you know hesitant to buying. To me, I'm like that's the bullish thing I could possibly hear.

alex_eph612: Yeah, and as long as they're still talking about it, you know that's better than nothing.

Kulture0x: But I mean, also that's because when you want to buy at the point where it feels the most worthless, the biggest fun moment ever possible, right? Like it couldn't get any lower than this, and you are even tempted to say, "Fuck it, I'm just gonna sell it and move on because it's never coming back. At that point, when you feel those emotions, that hopelessness, that is the best time to buy. Your emotions betray you. Well, think about

alex_eph612: it. You know, there's another perspective. You know, you can buy and sell without participating in the drama and the community. A

Kulture0x: lot of people do that. They don't want. They don't want to be. There's time. Yeah, people

saucestaja: over intellectually. We've over intellectualized this coin, specifically this coin, greatly.

Kulture0x: Yeah.

saucestaja: You know what I mean. Like it's been over intellectualized. People like they have such a sentimental value to the perceived. You know, I would call them gimmicks at this point. You know, friendship, this and that. It's just at the end of the day, it's a vehicle where investors and people don't learn how to invest in this market because it's always on to the next. And even if you do get cash off a coin, you're not going to mimic that same pattern and same playbook as most people try to do. Which is why a lot of those people cling on to the copy trades that are provided to them by, you know, the powers that be, is because they don't really know exactly what they're doing. So, you know, them not, you know, some people not really thinking of who's going to come back. That's great, honestly, because those are the people who don't really aren't really learning in the market, aren't really paying attention to these things in the market. They're just on to the next. And as far as I know, I'm sure you guys as well. I mean, in the history of mankind, no one's really amassed great wealth by just hopping on to the next one, hopping on to the next one, you know, it doesn't really work like that.

Kulture0x: We believe it was Warren Buffett who said wealth has a way of transferring from the impatient to the patient.

saucestaja: Yeah, exactly.

Kulture0x: You know, he's an old head.

saucestaja: Yeah, but what he says is true. That's where I got the money you make today isn't the same the way you make it tomorrow. That's where I got that from. The

Kulture0x: other thing is this: is like everything is cyclical, right? Like we went from being pretty balanced, I'd say, in our culture to being super woke, and now we're kind of finding that balance again. Is you know that it's like cyclical, right? And I think that crypto is the same way with the culture, which is why I changed my name to culture, is because it's also cyclical. You have the rotation before it was about holding long. That's how you gain wealth, and then it went into this ape mindset where you know you just want to get in and out rotation culture, and I feel like we're gonna go that once people realize that it doesn't work, you end up broke. We're gonna go back to the holding culture again. I think that's where we're gonna. That's I think that's where we're headed.

alex_eph612: Yeah, well, you know that you do kind of bring up an interesting point, and one thing that you're sort of hinting at, I think, is you know if you have a choice between deferring to the consensus of the original contract, or thinking that your way is the best way, and breaking off and shilling a competing contract. Now, whether or not that's on a different chain, or in APU in a different chain, or another meme coin on a different chain, or the same chain, it really doesn't matter. Like ultimately, you're breaking consensus with the existing community. So if you find yourself shilling a different token, no matter what it is, no matter what the reason is, you're essentially destroying one of the tenets of the foundation of the original launch. So that's you know that's the easy way out when you think your way is the best way.

Kulture0x: Murad doesn't shill other tokens and noise in Xboxy.

alex_eph612: Yeah, yeah, I'd love to say

saucestaja: the optics too as well because when you see somebody who's a diehard coiner, but then they're shilling other coins, it's kind of like yeah, it leaves a bad taste in your mouth. It's like that's not a serious person.

alex_eph612: Yeah, I get it that you know if someone is you know has a diverse portfolio and has a bunch of blue chips in their portfolio, right? And you know he says, "Oh, I like Pepe and I like SPX, you know that's perfectly fine, right? But if you see someone with. Like you know, 100 million market cap coins in their portfolio, and suddenly he's shilling some shitter that's you know sub 1 million market cap. You know you're going to start asking questions.

Kulture0x: Yeah, exactly. Like what? Because if you have if your portfolio is balanced like that, then you're going to practice a better risk tolerance, and you're not going to be spending your time shilling low cap shitters.

alex_eph612: Right. It means that you're not a serious person, or like you ran out of money, or you're scamming. Really, there really is no other you know options. You might you might lie to yourself and think that you're part of some sort of like cult community, but you know that's really not the case.

Kulture0x: And here's another thing: if someone, yeah, I don't know if I'm going to get into that, but I still encounter someone like that took almost half a million dollars from a you know a treasury is going to sit there and start accusing other people of being whales. You had every opportunity to buy as much you know the token as everyone else. The other thing is this: is if you are also we're in a bear market, and you're spending your time shilling low cap shitters, trying to extract from people who are already broke like you. You know, you should be out there. You should get a real job, take that paycheck and buy the token, become a whale. Because at 5 million market cap. It's not hard,

alex_eph612: right? It's you know for everything that anyone can say. You know there is a lot of money out there, and you know there is a way to get some and put it into the token.

Kulture0x: Yeah, I mean you can you know just with AI out there, you can build apps. They can it can help you with listing shit on eBay. It can help you build websites, you know, buying shit from China and reselling and running ads on Facebook. There's so many ways to make out there. Like

saucestaja: that's a that's an actual job, though. They don't want to do that.

Kulture0x: That's exactly work.

alex_eph612: Here's this thing. Like where I live in the Pacific Northwest, we just have a fuck ton of fires just burning the shit out everywhere. Yeah, I

Kulture0x: my I used to live in Spokane a long time ago, man. That whole place burned down.

alex_eph612: Yeah, so there's like fire damage a mile away from my house. So the point I'm trying to make is like you could very easily just start importing like those bushwhackers from China, you know that the things that you can attach to skid steers and just start renting them out, and just you're gonna make a million dollars in a fucking year because everyone wants to you know cut all their shrubbery and do forestry to prevent fires,

Fren 1: right?

alex_eph612: In this in this area, it's just so easy to make some money without having to like scam anyone.

saucestaja: That would also yeah, but in crypto it's easy because I mean there's people who are very very gullible. They're very subjective and they come here to make money. They believe that they can make a lot of money. That's the thing that gets them is they actually believe it, and when they see posts, when they see like quote whales, when they see people who are in those high market cap coins, they give off an impression of success. And when you have an impression of success and you're subjective and you want to make money, you're just going to put your pennies where you think your dollars are. Yeah, that's true. That's kind of like that's kind of like the approach. It felt like when they start talking about whales, as if we need not the whales. Like yeah, you need whales in your project, but to rely solely on whales kind of gives up. You kind of forfeit your whole entire. You know, you kind of forfeit your whole entire like culture for the coin, essentially. Especially if you're over intellectualizing it and you want to make it about friendship or whatever, you know. I think there is a lot of missteps with that, but doesn't mean that we. It's dead. It's done. That doesn't mean that. You know, it's just a change of ownership, change of guard.

alex_eph612: You know, any anyone can contribute in a way that they like. You know, it's not gatekept. Well, you know, the previous team did gatekeep a little bit, but you know, we're routing around that, but you know you got to realize that a lot of these so-called whales made their money in Apu in the first place, right? Or they used to be considered whales, but now owning 900 million tokens is only $15,000. So it really doesn't take all that much money to become an Apu whale.

Kulture0x: Yeah, and 15,000. Dollars in the current economy is like $3,000 in 2017.

alex_eph612: Very sad.

saucestaja: Yeah, I think that's where it went wrong. Was the whole whale culture? It was fun when everybody was on the same playing field and nobody really knew how much coins people had because no one cared, and they were just like involved in APU to make memes and have fun, and then it came into it became this beast where it's like, okay, now we're gonna figure out who's the whale. We're gonna start kind of like, for some, and it makes sense hindsight. It makes sense hindsight now that you kind of ostracize the people who have money, because if you want their money, you're gonna ostracize them and kind of point like kind of. Put them in a place where you can keep better eyes on them. I guess is what I'm trying to say, right? And that sentiment hasn't died off when you're, especially when you go off and you sell like a $1 million market cap coin, and then you have a staking pool, and basically it's just a way to track wallets who have higher aloes? It's like I don't understand how people can't catch on to these things. Well, it's so obvious.

alex_eph612: You have to understand that, like before this whole what you call whale culture has existed, there was people that were LARPing with their holdings, and you know they were. Do you mind turning your speaker down just a little bit? I'm picking up audio. Okay. They were larping about their holdings. You know you had you had these scammers that came into the community and said, okay, well you know I have this much on Kraken. You know they would they would get a lot of like. You know, for better or for worse, they would get an undue amount of intention for the amount of you know their perceived wealth, and you know eventually there came a moment when they would like ask to borrow money or something like that, and then they would they would get it and then they would disappear. So that's part one, and part two was you had these whales. Like every time that there was a dip in the chart, the whales would get blamed, right? These so-called whales. And before I started cataloging the actual real personalities behind those wallets, there was always this like certain degree of FUD with regards to whales, right? And they would, they were these unknowns. They had hundreds of, you know, yeah,

saucestaja: they were they were unknown. Every pump we would get, they would sell into it, and then it would be like we'd be mad at the whales, mad at the whales. Everyone get mad at the wheels for selling into the pump,

alex_eph612: right? I

saucestaja: remember that like it was yesterday. I remember because we would have we would have sick pumps, bro. And then I would wake up in the morning just to fully retrace, and I'm like, "What the fuck? Like, I know everyone I'm talking to in the space call. I know they're gonna hold. So who the fuck is literally nuking the fucking chart?

alex_eph612: Yeah, you know that's a very good point. So that was exactly my sentiment, you know. And I was just trying to figure out who all these guys were and try to get them to you know all come together and hold. And you know this is you know because this is kind of like a permissionless system. You can't really force someone to hold. You know, you can't coerce them. You essentially have to offer them a better deal and say, "Look, you know, you come together with camaraderie and appreciation for your fellow frog, or whatever. You know, hold your tokens together. Stop fucking selling. Stop nuking the chart. And you know, there was there was a certain degree of success in that because a lot of a lot of these people that join, they don't sell until they crash out, right? You know, yeah, that

saucestaja: was that was me. That was me because I had I had a reasonable crash out because there was a lot of bullshit going on at that time, but you're right, it's good until it's not

alex_eph612: right. So like for example, Green, you know Green is a very emotional dude, and he was in our whale chat, but at some point he left. Well, actually, he left multiple times, and then

saucestaja: yeah, I was I was gone before you guys started the whole whale shit. I never had a chance to talk to Green. This is like my second time talking to you in voice, so I left way early.

alex_eph612: Yeah, sounds like

saucestaja: the party just got started when I left. That sucks.

alex_eph612: Well, hopefully we can have a party again. But the point I'm trying to make is that you know you're always going to have whales, right? There's it's not like my involvement in finding them is going to influence whether or not they exist. It's just. And some at some point you either know who they are or you don't, right? And that's really the only difference.

itsvibekilla: Yo, I got Bear Team Six organizing a strike team against 5g for IP infinite.

alex_eph612: Yeah, that's great, man. I hope that amazing. I hope that it works out for you.

itsvibekilla: It's gonna work out. He's gonna die.

alex_eph612: Well, we're all gonna die. Yeah. No, he's gonna die

itsvibekilla: sooner though. Like

saucestaja: maybe because of stress. Hopefully he has a heart. Maybe he stressed out. Maybe he actually has a heart. Maybe he's not the Grinch. And you know, it just is what it is, and it's spilt milk. You know, and some of us picked up on it earlier than others. And there's no there's no bad

itsvibekilla: versions of the battlefield I'm sending them to.

saucestaja: There's nothing like for me. Like I can't do shit about it. You know what I'm saying? Like I got hit up by fucking CTMZ because I guess Maxie was in her ear about some shit, you know. Like, hopefully, fucking works out, dude. Because that's all you can do is

itsvibekilla: pray and forgiveness. Because I'm not listening. You can

yourbandicoot: pray.

Kulture0x: Yeah, you know, I don't recommend anyone doing any violence or anything like that towards anyone. But you know,

itsvibekilla: I'm doing it with love.

Kulture0x: There you go.

alex_eph612: He's gonna send Bobina as an assassin.

itsvibekilla: Oh, she's gonna send me. I'm her top warrior.

alex_eph612: Bobina's top guy.

Kulture0x: You know, I if someone wants to have a salary or something like that, I get it because if you're doing something full time, then you know you need to live. But I feel like there should be some accounting, and you should go into it knowing that. Maybe that was part of our fault too. Not saying we're to blame for taking the money. Obviously, that's on him. But you know, I think we were so in cloud nine, we're distracted with our greed or whatever it is because we're in a bull market, and you know the wine is flowing, and we didn't put the proper guardrails in place. Say, okay, well, who's we didn't ask the right questions. Like, is it going to be audited? Is there going to be visibility into this contract? Maybe that was him doing the sleight of hand at the time, understanding the dynamics. Well,

saucestaja: if we would have asked those questions, we would have had Shroom on the mic because 5G never talks. He uses Shroom to talk.

itsvibekilla: That's a good point.

saucestaja: So Shroom, Shroom, Shroom would have like been like two more. It would have made it a meme. Two more Weems. Two more weems. That's always

itsvibekilla: suspect if somebody doesn't want to talk. Yeah,

saucestaja: that's what I'm saying. No

itsvibekilla: offense, Cairo. I love you. You're the only person I trust. Who?

saucestaja: No, but we. It's like he never. He would never. And he has everybody else docs. If you guys notice, so he has pain docs, great docs. Everybody doxes to do the promotions and spend the money besides him. Apparently, he does have a dox out. None of my business, but I just-it's what I'm pointing out, though, is that all the people who like get coerced into this guy's thing end up doxing themselves while he can get away scot-free. Essentially, you know, it's kind of fucked up because Bellows did a whole ass dox for fucking Bazinga, his face and everything, and just to have nothing happen. That's fucked up, dude. You know what I'm saying? Like just to have, and I thought like High Council. I and I always thought this. I thought it was literally all four of those guys, five of those guys, literally in control of the wallet. I thought there was like a multi sig or something. I didn't know it was just 5g.

alex_eph612: Yeah, there are some people that thought it was multi sig. You know, from the people that I know on Telegram. You know, because it seems absolutely crazy to them that a single guy is in control of a wallet that has millions of dollars.

saucestaja: Yes. Well, Rec does it just

itsvibekilla: fine. You just gotta fucking be transparent about it. You can't just say it's like you know multi segment. It's not.

alex_eph612: Well, I think the only way that works, the only way that works, is if the guy that's in control has a lot more money, because he's not gonna you know want to steal like whatever 5% or 10% of his net worth.

Kulture0x: That makes for

saucestaja: drained the last $300 in the community wallet. Like really?

alex_eph612: Yeah. The

saucestaja: last $300. He took the last

itsvibekilla: $300.

yourbandicoot: Yeah.

alex_eph612: Well, here's the thing. Like there was a point in time when the Apu account. had held some NFTs and essentially sold all of them into bots for like pennies on the dollar. And you know those bots they don't have a lot of liquidity, so they're obviously going to offer like a lot less than if you were to sell for like. One per day, so he just liquidated. I don't know how many like dozens in a single period of time, and you know those got relisted immediately for a lot more. And like, it really seems like he was like playing double or nothing on RainBet, and like he needed that liquidity. He

saucestaja: was definitely gambling. I know he's. I know he's a gambler. Definitely.

alex_eph612: Yeah,

saucestaja: that's that you could tell by the pattern of how things are too. Like, yeah, he took, dude. He took he took so much fucking money, dude, and now he's chilling, happy, and it can even break three mil market cap, bro. It's like dead. It's the saddest fucking shit ever. But what's fucking sad about is there's still fucking people that fucking don't realize what the fuck is going on. It's yeah. I want to hit my head with my head with a hammer.

alex_eph612: Yeah, you know, this is something I've encountered in my own personal and professional life. Like there are some people that are just lost causes, and the only thing they understand is power, right? So as long as there's a little bit of power somewhere and they can all coalesce around it, that's really all they want to be happy.

saucestaja: Yeah, that's a good point because they're all pseudo personalities, like whatever personality, like that's them, and now that's that unhappy. Now you're right about that. Yeah, it's like some psychological shit.

Kulture0x: You can't logic someone out of position they didn't logic themselves into.

alex_eph612: Yeah, you know, I just I did say something a little bit earlier today in Capital Flow based. there's this guy and his name is Molly, and he said the Bobo community is the same with that Rektashi guy. He just serially deploys new tokens, claiming he's making tokens to farm for Bobo, but the price of Bobo doesn't go up, and the only people buying his mass deploy slop are obviously only Bobo holders, but all they do is defend him like he's some sort of god figure, which is crazy because he didn't even create Bobo in the first place.

itsvibekilla: Actually, I got receipts. He did.

alex_eph612: Well, this is me quoting him. I don't know anything about it.

itsvibekilla: I know it's just there's so much cope about him like making Bobo did like he's been doing this since 2015.

saucestaja: That's the thing, though. That's the thing. It's it becomes all about them. Like you're, it's like whether you are or you're not. It's like they're jealous. They're threatening. Like they wish they could be that guy. Like that's what it ultimately comes down to in this space, is like oh, he's just hating because, like, if you were doing good, then why would you care? Is that fucking

itsvibekilla: wrong, though? Like, I'm just gonna be real, dude. There's

saucestaja: truth to it. There's truth to it.

itsvibekilla: Is like, look, if I know I meme about IP and shit because, like, whatever. But if you guys like, if one day you found the guy who fucking first posted Apu, right? There's always a thread to this shit. It always goes back to somebody, right? So if you found that thread and you followed it all the way back to whoever made Apu, it'd kind of be the same situation if you brought him on board. It's like whatever he would say would be law in kind of a weird way because he's the originator, you know. Fucking Matt Pepe. If Matt Fury drew something new with Pepe, everyone would follow through with it because he fucking made Pepe, you know. So yeah, there's a lot of jealousy with that shit, dude. I'm not saying like.

saucestaja: Well, I wouldn't say it's jealousy. I think it's. I mean, yeah. I mean, if you want to, if you want to be one of those people that can just shill random coins and just have people buy it,

itsvibekilla: I'm not talking about that. I'm just talking about like the fact that he made Bobo, dude.

Fren 2: He just made it popular. If

saucestaja: he, if he was like the originator of Bobo, if he was that guy, that's dope. You can't, you can't take that away from the guy. But it's like if you got to have like you got to be a good steward to what you're what you're fostering, right? Like if you if you did make Bobo, if I made Bobo, I wouldn't be and this is just me. I mean, and these are allegations. I wouldn't theoretically be making meme coins just to fucking potentially punt my coin, but have it stay crabby. I know, but I watched the guy. I

itsvibekilla: watched the guy round trip 1.5 million on BoJack. It's like if he was in it for the money, he would have fucking just dumped his whole bag. Like he literally lost $20,000 on Queenus, and he just bought it to support.

saucestaja: But let me let me and that's dope. That's really dope. Like if you watch that, but let me let me say something though too to kind of make you help you think about it. Is that there's mult there's always multiple wallets and the wallets that you're watching are not necessarily the ones that they're trading with all the time. So, and this is what the FOMO traders do as well. All those top P and Ls are basically just dummy wallets, and they're not really trading. Yeah, it's wash. I

itsvibekilla: kind of have this philosophy where like. If you do run a project, and you do like if you do buy it, it just it's natural to assume that you're gonna sell too. Like, in fact, it'd be retarded if you didn't because you're you are the steward of the project. You have to make money, right? Am I am I wrong there? Am I am I speaking crazy? Because like no,

saucestaja: but has to be a turnover. Made it people made it like culture, I guess, with bunny ears on it, like culture, cult, culture to not sell. But those are the people that are taking advantage of their holders, is because they're the ones who are actually selling at the back end every single time. Okay, but what's what I've realized?

itsvibekilla: Yeah, that's a lot of that's a lot of communities, but like fucking new pairs and shit., I don't think you should crucify a guy for, you know, just pressing to play on pump fun. I mean, like,

saucestaja: no, no, no, I'm not, I'm not. I have, I have nothing. There's just people that are crazy like that. You know what I mean?

itsvibekilla: Like, there's this guy Abu Chancellor I fuck around with, who, yeah, he's just obsessed. Like he went to the point where he messaged. I don't like drama. I fucking hate drama. It's gay, but he literally messaged Chef's 16-year-old daughter, like asking about wrecked. Like it's fucked up.

Fren 1: Yeah, that's pretty fucked.

itsvibekilla: That's really fucked, dude. Like there's trolling on Twitter and then there's like being creepy.

Kulture0x: Yeah, and I'm a dad to a girl, so I mean,

itsvibekilla: I'm not a dad yet, but like, man, there's no dad. I'd be killing somebody over that, dude.

Fren 2: Yeah, there's

saucestaja: really no accountability here, bro. Like, if you can see where you rug people, and no one's really like tell like you can't. There's no one telling you to stop, or nothing's preventing you from rugging everybody every single day, yeah. It's like it starts to affecting your personality over times. I mean, that's why a lot of these people act the way they do in crypto. They like look at what happened to fucking Bitcoin, fucking Ben, fucking whatever the fuck his name was. Oh yeah,

Kulture0x: that was the fun crash shot to watch.

saucestaja: Like he, that's the best example is like you get into your head like you're this person you made all this money and then you literally just degrade yourself and that's what a lot of people do.

itsvibekilla: Robotnik for me, I personally watch them like spiral out, and it's not fun to see. Like I generally, Doctor

saucestaja: Robotnik was on a space celebrating the fact he made enough money to buy an Xbox, so he went from doing that to doing what he did. Like, yeah, you see it. Everyone's like, it might. I don't want to be harsh, but everyone's just for target. Oh

itsvibekilla: no, he's a broke ass nigga. Fuck it, fuck talk to your robot, Nick. I'll say it with my chest, man. Like, he messaged me for like he launched some pump fund shitter, and he asked me, "He's like, yo, I want to partner with you. I want to partner with Bobina. I'm like, "Okay, what do you want to do? And he's like, "I launched Bitcoin BTCB Bitcoin Prediction Bot for Poly Market. It's like this cloud code thing. So he offered me trading fees, like creator fees, and this shit was dead in the water. It was a fucking 10k topper, and he, I asked Chef about him. He's known as the guy you never want to loan money to him because he'll never pay you back. He was asking me for $200 in Claude Code credits. He was going to give me creator fees. That was my red flag with him. I tried being cool with him, but then he started having this hate bone. He started hanging around the alchemist and these board ape yacht club guys.

Kulture0x: Oh yeah, yeah,

saucestaja: all those guys.

Fren 2: They're just

itsvibekilla: fucking faggots, dude. I hate every single one. I don't hate board ape, but I really do hate some of their titular figures. Just screams estrogen and microplastics.

saucestaja: They're all scammers. They all they all were part of the whole fucking cereal rugging things, shilling fucking bullshit coins, getting allocated drops for coins just to sell. They're all scammers. It fucks my friend Hexover,

itsvibekilla: who he's co-authoring Bobi and his model with me because we're doing episode one in Blunder and shit. Like he fucked him over three years ago because they were doing this Board Ape Yacht Club game. I think it's called Other Side now, but back then, like they were just doing meshes and shit. Didn't fucking pay him. Had him do like a bunch of 3d work. All these other artists did 3d work. When it came time to pay him, they basically said "fuck you, and they made like a little channel, like a wall of shame, where they put their profile and just say, "Ha ha, we got one over on him. So fuck alchemist; he's a little brokey. Can't pay $300 to like 3d generalists,

saucestaja: even if he has money or if he doesn't have money. You know the fact that he just allocates a lot of time out of his day to just run a space that doesn't produce any value, you know. I have my own opinions about it, you know, and they're not really savory opinions because I don't think he's a good person at the. But that's all my opinion at the end of the day. Oh, that's a fact. That's a the economy's crashing, and you can see that. Reflected in the market because people literally, they're running out of money. They're going broke. They're doing all this. They're yeah, they're extra scamming now. I said excess, but

itsvibekilla: extra scamming too. Yeah, exit. No, yeah,

saucestaja: they're ex scamming, extra scamming. Yeah, you know it's, and I dude, I don't know, dude. I really hope people realize who the fuck 5g is, bro. Because we had a good thing with APU. APU really could have fucking ran, bro. Well, like I think it still will. It will. It definitely will. And it's gonna run harder, and it's gonna actually do a hockey stick because now we have people who are fucking like they're out. They're not. They're no longer part of it, they think of who everyone in here is broke. They think the coins. It's still a fucking like six mil, seven mil market cap. That's not dead. That's not dead at all. Are you kidding me? Not only that, but yeah, the cancer has kind of been cut out. Oh yeah,

itsvibekilla: needed to happen. I heard shit about the Blew stuff too. It's like,

saucestaja: well, that's another thing too. It was mismanaged by the High Council because we all knew Blew Era or whatever his name was. He's brand. He was brand new to crypto. Apu was his first ever introduction to crypto ever.

itsvibekilla: God damn, ever lucky. Oh

saucestaja: yeah, yeah, dude. You call it lucky, you can call it cursed, but that was his first introduction ever, bro. And he actually did do a good speed run because he actually ended up running a talk show host thing that just ended up just being a dead end. But not too many people their first time ever in crypto get that experience. But that's what Apu fostered for this guy.

alex_eph612: Yeah,

saucestaja: that's gonna be better in the future. Well, are you

itsvibekilla: guys are you guys on bad like? Because I know, I actually don't know. Like, I hear fucking high counsel, and I hear like under new management. I just kind of assume it's the same thing. But like with, with him, did you guys like burn the bridge with him? Is it like not cool anymore? Because like that that's a lot of money to pay someone to like. I'll tell you

saucestaja: what. When he first joined, Shroom kept calling him a dirty Jew. Like no one liked him. Everybody actually hated him. But once they realized they can use him, because this is what they do. 5g uses you until you have no more use for him. They realized, hey, this guy we can use. Right? He's like that. He already wants to kind of be somebody on the internet, anyways. He's posting fitness pictures. He's really putting himself out there, right? So let's like pay this guy eight grand a month and facilitate his little talk show. Not even just to promote value, just so they can kind of keep on, I guess, doing their little exit liquidity run. I don't know.

itsvibekilla: 5g fucked up. He should have paid me double, and I would have talked about Bobina instead of FC. They also paid. They

saucestaja: also paid Pat, not Maxi Pat, but the other Pat. They paid him like a couple grand too to like quote come back to the community and like they're all they're all they just mismanaged the fuck out of that money, bro.

itsvibekilla: I think it's good on him that he made his money. I'm not. I actually like the guy. I don't I don't think he did wrong by running his bag up. I heard about the other shit. I'm blissfully unaware. I prefer to stay blissfully unaware because I just don't like drama, but if that's how it is, man, just don't run another stream where you're paying some dude that much. That's like actually crazy. I've never that's the first time I've ever heard about that in crypto, like where you paid somebody a white collar salary to just run like OBS

saucestaja: while he's an attorney making, I'm sure he makes good money being an attorney. Yeah, like yeah, dude.

itsvibekilla: Yeah, he's already making good money. Well, you have to

alex_eph612: understand that the contract was signed at like literally the exact peak of crypto in 2025. Oh, you guys signed a contract. Yeah. So there was a cost breakdown of how much he would, you know, get paid versus how much his staff would. I gotta give

itsvibekilla: a left fucking testicle just to get somebody to sign a fucking NDA. Wait, wait, somebody signed a contract.

saucestaja: Wait, Alex, did you? I don't want to. I don't want to sound like a total arrogant dickhead because I'm just saying things, but like, there's a lot of things I don't know. Did you happen to facilitate that?

Fren 1: Yes.

saucestaja: Okay. Okay. I. Okay. Okay. Okay.

alex_eph612: So Blew had approached the High Council, essentially saying that he could be a top performer if he could actually get money to pay his staff, right? And we drafted a contract to essentially facilitate that, but you know, actually, you know, let me pull up my notes.

itsvibekilla: And he didn't void that contract when you guys parted ways either. It was kind of like within lockstep of the terms.

alex_eph612: So, let me actually find the notes so that I don't say anything incorrectly. But I can basically say that everything there is the absolute truth, and there's no like, there's no lies in anything. But I do need a moment to find it.

saucestaja: Yeah, I wish I would have stayed on communications a little bit better because I would have, I would have let you know that earlier. But it's all good, you know. I'm a jerk.